Is This Deja Vu All Over Again?
posted by Allen Barrett | 11:55 AM
Giles Free Speech Zone
The purpose of the "Giles Free Speech Zone" is to identify problems of concern to the people of Giles County, to discuss them in a gentlemanly and civil manner, while referring to the facts and giving evidence to back up whatever claims are made, making logical arguments that avoid any use of fallacy, and, hopefully, to come together in agreement, and find a positive solution to the problem at hand. Help make a difference! Email "mcpeters@usit.net" to suggest topics or make private comments.
Contributors
- Looking for a reason to vote against Obama?
- Flag of Our Fathers
- Water Discount to Senior and Disabled Citizens
- Change to City Ordinance on Beer Sales
- Contract for the City Administrator
- Skate Park Near Completion
- Sale of Hunter Smith Building?????
- School Calendar
- Request to move funds in school budget
- Evaluation of School Director
51 Comments:
The reason that this may go on the August ballot again is because many voted against the 1/4% increase because the price for the renovations to the park were too high. Now that the plan has been scaled back, many who voted against it before have stated that they would be willing to vote for this slight increase. If taxes must be raised, this is far and away the best way to do it!
((would be willing to vote for this slight increase))
It's a lot of money for a graduation!!! What ever happened to the $100k bleachers that sounded too high?
Okay I could see the Financial Management vote because the majority of the citizens did not vote the first time (I'm sure if I'm wrong I will be corrrected). This time the majority of the citizens voted so what good is the revote going to do unless they are counting on more people not caring if it happens and they don't go vote. Everyone knew that during the presidential vote that we just had that more peope would go to the polls.
instead of every person who makes a purchase inside the city limits, the people who pay for the renovations to Sam Davis park are those who USE IT! What about a $1.00 "user fee" tacked on to each ticket sold to sporting events at this facility? Yes, even little league. That way, those that use it will be paying for it. I personally do not go to games at that park, and do not feel I should have to pay for something that I don't care it it remains or not. But then, SHAME ON the city of Pulaski for not MAINTAINING their facilities. What do those people think? You build it and it lasts forever?????
More people will shop out of town.
What part of NO don't the government understand?
I think it is sad for people to say that only the people who use it should pay for it. What if I graduated from school 10 years ago and have no children? Should I pay taxes for education now? Why should I have to pay for roads that I do not drive on? What if I never draw unemployment?
You want to pay $2 million so you can graduate in the park instead of the school that obviously didn't teach you how hard it is to get $$$$$$$$!?
If the park is not renovated properly, then the school system will have to buy land and build a football stadium. If that happens, the property owners of the county will foot the bill.
There is reluctance by the county to fund something that belongs to the city (read Speer). County already owns property. Why not the county build, remove themselves from Speer. It wouldnt cost any more than the two million they are now talking about.
Then again, where is the money coming from for anything? If they borrow it will most likely be a tax hike.
4:55 - education IS different, even if the only reason some people go to school is to play sports. What we have forgotten is that sport are EXTRAcurricular. They are NOT the curriculum, and the taxpayers should not be expected to pay for the EXTRA.
Get over the property tax bull crap - the issue is TAX & any TAX is paid by the residents & a sales tax, property tax, or dumb ass wheel tax is going to be paid by people who have the money to pay it! JUST SAY NOOOOO! BECAUSE IT AIN"T NEEDED!! HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH FAIRNESS!!!!!!!
8:10 you got it right. The problem ain't that we're short of money but that we have to much spending.
Without the county getting some controls on the spending a tax increase will only lead to another and another with each individual losing more of their disposable income which of course leads to a greater downturn in the economy.
So how would you last two propose to fix the problems? You are awfully quick to condemn, and you have all of the answers, but you don't know what you are talking about!
I can tell you this FOR SURE! If the 1/4% sales tax is not passed, then the property taxes WILL go up.
Not if enough commissioners have the balls to say NO!
Some budget cutting would be good as well.
The high school MUST have a place to play football! There will be a price to pay. The 1/4% is a much better way to pay than a property tax increase!
Not having enough money to pay for what you want is your problem, not mine! You folks were dead sure about killing financial management, the sales tax, & Mr Wheel tax's wheel tax, but all went down in flames! Citizens are sick and tired of lost jobs, no pay increases, leaky school buildings, and teachers not getting raises while spending everywhere else goes over the moon, & a school administration that don't know right from wrong.
I'd hate to be a commissioner voting for a property tax increase! They'd have to sleep on the run. I'm sure you can make a lot of noise with the band and booster club, but you're fixing to screw the people one time too many.
When I run out of money, I stop spending! Priorities have to change. That's the bottom line, & you are nowhere on that list! Matter of fact, your football game isn't on it & isn't going to be. If you want more money, raffle off the new admin building - you sure don't need it!
Here you are, threatening citizens if they don't come up with $2 or $3 million to play football, the whole world will end. You just got done telling the teachers & others there just wasn't any money for raises or competitive salaries! It isn't about education. It isn't even about football. It's about a hand full of lunatics spending other people's money!
The football field is still there! Play ball on it! Bring your own chair or stay home!
So you would fix the problem by doing away with football and band and pop warner etc? You would tear the stands down and just leave the field? I am really curious to know how you would fix the problem if the people trusted you to make those decisions?
Looks like 825 answered your question - works for football & pop warner & any other thing an open field can accomodate! If the stands are a hazzard, get a highway buldozer in there, pile it up, & haul it away with highway trucks - give them a little overtime if need be - they do know what they are doing & can do a fine job of it!
Football is a game - $3 or $4 million ISN"T to a community full of hard luck people! There are a lot more down & outers 24hrs & 7 days a week than there are at any ball game & not just friday night! You want to represent a hand full of people who can afford to pay their way! - at the expense many who can't! It's a matter of whose trust you keep & whose you not only breach, but who take from!
The field is there - play ball or forget it. If you want something that fits your zone of comfort & inspectability, take up a collection, charge admission, or get another job to get what it takes to make you happy - leave me out of the collection drive.
School, is a place to learn how to read, write, add, science, history, etc. - not how to run up and down a field, how to be a pervert, & to not defend one's self & family.
With Bill Holt as chairman of the budget committee and tommy Campbell and Janet Vanzant on this committee to research what to do about the park you can for sure expect a tax hike. If not a tax hike then they will spend for the park and take away from people getting water in the county. That was what most of the commissioner stated they would push to get to everyone in the county when they were running in their election, now see whats going on. Holt, Campbell and Vanzant always get what they want and you can bet there wont be enough other commissioners to say NO to all this outlandish spending.
How are you going to attract industry, or anything else if your high school doesn't have decent extra curricular activities. Don't be short sighted. Now really, how would you really solve the problem?
I just wonder how many of the people who are whining about these taxes smoke, drink and play the lottery?
I do not do any of the three, and I think that the taxes should not be raised. I think that they should do what we have to do when we don't have the money. We do without until we do.
What all would you be willing to do without? Roads? Ambulance Service? Police protection? Schooling? Bussing the children to schools? Other?
246 Do without? you, the ambulance service, The jackson boondoggles, and your dumb assed football park.
Fire the school drones & give the money to the teachers who want to work and teach. Sell the adm palace & fix the roofs. There has been more than enough money to do almost anything, but a few termites have turned it into sawdust! Dump the termites, get a life, & shove your taxes up you know where.
No rational business has or will come to a community absessed with tax increase after increase! Get another buy line!
Lets do without the county & city employees that we really don't need. Trust me, we have a lot of them. We could get the same amount done with less employees, if they were MADE TO WORK! Not that long ago, I saw an old friend in Wal Mart, looking at board games. As we talked and caught up on old times, he told me that he was looking for a new board game to play at work because they were tired of the same old board games they had there. He was and still is a Pulaski Street Department Employee. It must be nice to play games and get paid for doing it on the TaxPayer's Dimes, huh?
And, don't bother thinking that I made that story up...you can't make up stuff like that!
It is ridiculous to re-vote on an issue...regardless of how many voted before or their reasons for voting the way they did. An election was held on an advertised day and voters had the opportunity to vote. The results were certified and that should be the end of it. Another vote would not only be a tremendous waste of taxpayer dollars but also an abuse of power.
As for the football stadium, whoever owns it is responsible for the upkeep. If they can't afford it, sell it, or charge a user fee, per school, event, season, organization or however they choose.
A community is only as good as it's public schools, so regardless of whether a citizen has children, grandchildren or is childless, the schools are everyone's responsibility.
The new Central Office bldg is an awful waste, but not in the way most think. They did not need an annex. The entire bldg should have been gutted and one new building erected. The cost would have been slightly more, but over the long run, so much more efficient. The present building is unsafe, unclean, has outdated wiring that make modern technology impossible to operate and is an embarrassment to the county. Whoever made the final decision to build an inadequate annex instead of doing the job correctly not only misused public funds but is also a coward. I say that because even though many of our citizens don't realize that a new building was not a luxury, but a necessity, the final decision maker should have had the guts to do what was right and ethical and bring the CO building up to 21st standards. Few may not realize it, but the money for a new CO building has been in the budget for years, it CANNOT be used for any other purpose and has actually lost value due to inflation. So with each administration that did not build a totally new co bldg. the county and it's citizens were actually robbed of tax dollars.
Many will say that the co staff should not have a new building, but as stated the money can be spent on nothing else and the current building is substandard. Those are the facts and NO I do not work for the co, don't care for Tee Jackson's politics, am not a county commissioner, etc. Just an average citizen who is embarrassed with the condition of public buildings when the money is avaiable.
anon 56
What an amazing idea that money had to be used for the Central Office and nothing else and that by not building the thing sooner the taxpayers lost money. That sounds just like my wife who has tried to convince me at times that she could save money by buying a pair of shoes that was on sale even though she didn't need the shoes and wouldn't even consider buying them at the regular price. Next thing we know they'll be telling us that if they could just build another new building we would really be making money. Hey here's an idea
how about taking money away from the teachers hire some more high paid administrators and build another annex for them to sit in, oh rats that's already been done. oh well I'm sure the miners will figure it out they still have some shafts left. Allen Barrett
That's not what that post meant, Mr. Barrett. And I hesitated to post that info for the very reasons that you stated. I would agree that while a new co is/was needed, what was built was a short sighted pacifier for what I can only assume a few political heavy weights in the county. I agree that priorities have to be set and the co should not be at the top of the list, the individual schools, teacher's salaries and supply money should absolutely come first. My point was, and I do know that this information is absolutely correct is that the money in this particular building fund which dates back to Sam Collins days was earmarked for admistrative offices. It has been sitting in an account for years, sure, drawing interest, but nowhere near the rate of inflation. The short-sightedness of building an expensive annex with, if I am not mistaken only 6 offices is a complete misuse of this fund. 10 or 15 years ago, the money set aside would have been more than adequate to build a state of the art building that would be adequate for many years and all offices could be housed in one building. That is what should have happened. The old building is a fire trap, a health risk to all who enter, filled with mold as are any older buildings. The wiring is so outdated that many times pieces of equipment must be unplugged in order to plug in other equipment. My other point is that suppose the new building cost 700k (and this is just a number for illustration purposes, I have no idea what the cost was) For an additional 200k, the old building could have been demolished and a single building built in its place. Like it or not, the central office is necessary for the operation of the schools, there are many many hard working folks there, just trying to feed their families. Not everyone is on the level with Jackson. And please let me re-phasize, this money was locked into an irrevocable "line item" for lack of a better term, there was no other option but to use it for building a co. Trust me, if I could post publicly you would know from previous posts on various topics, that I am not saying that the annex was the answer. While the dollar difference in my example and again I say it was only an example, (Can't you just hear the rumors tomorrow???) I still believe that the more efficient and wiser investment would have been to do the job correctly and built a whole new building. I hope I have clarified the issue, I am not defending the building of the new offices, not at all. And with the huge constuction cost increase in the past decade, I truly think that we have lost a great deal of purchasing power. I'll leave it at that, have a feeling this info will create a firestorm of name calling and smart aleck remarks from most of the anons out there, but understand, please, I am stating a fact, not offering an opinon.
anon56
anonymous...
That was an excellent post. Yes, I'm afraid the usual complaining with begin right away with regard to what tou said.
Sadly, Mr. Barrett missed the point.
Have you heard of chlorox or the same stuff sold at savalot for half its price? It shurnuff kills mould. Add a little soap & water & the scum disappears with it.
Will anyone ever really know how much the new monstrosity cost? How about the building renovation beside it - anyone know the numbers? Did any of the phds behind these fiascos think to wire it? Wiring is a drop in the bucket compared to total dwelling cost and it isn't an earth shaking project to correct it!!! But why fix when you can build something new - money grows on trees & the leaves will soon be sprouting again.
Sell both of them & buy a couple of double wides. $700,000 (a million?) for 6 offices!?!?!!! If you put the peacocks in the same pen as the chickens, they'll learn to scratch for food like the rest of the world.
Imagine - a typical family living in a trailer, both parents working & struggling to make ends meet, hand me downs, & no way it's going to improve, with kids who see the movers & shakers parking their elephant outside the admin building, big plush couch & coupl4e of sweet damsels fanning the air, TV on the wall watching I Love Lucy & Gunsmoke reruns ... and they plot to raise the parents taxes! Life is a hoot for some & a toot for others!
As far as this year's graduation is concerned, why dont they have it at Martin inside or out? It was done back in the 80's for two different classes because those classes had more students than normal. Mr. Hastings said the gym is too small and he is correct. The last one that was held inside was HORRIBLE!!!!!! Now, as far as repairs for Sam Davis go, fix the bleachers and that's IT!!!!There is no need for all that extra "FIXING" up. Its ridiculous!!The other stuff was fine until the bleachers messed up!!!The Class of 2008 does not want to graduate in ther gym.(I have a neice graduating this year and she told me the graduates have discussed it) I'll be more than happy to take my lawn chair.
To Anonymous of the 9 Mar 11:58 post.
Perhaps my understanding of your first post was not what you meant it to say and I apologize if I misunderstood the meaning. I agree the money had been sitting drawing interest for a long period of time and it had been designated for a new central office. Here’s my problem, where in the past number of budgets has this money been reflected. Was it off the books, was it hidden in some other line item, how was it being carried and accounted for? Now with the amazing ability shown for moving money from one line item to another can you explain why this item could not have been moved other than the lack of desire? My point is that while this was money designated for a specific purpose so was about $300,000.00 dollars for teacher salaries. When those teachers were not hired the money wasn’t kept in that line item but moved into other areas and possibly helped pay the huge salary increase for Mrs. Sigmon.
The things you mention about the old central office building where among the things stated over and over as reasons why a new central office was necessary. At one point the director even stated that the building may be condemned. I agree with you that the old building is not in very good shape when compared with many others. Here’s my problem. If the old building was actually in the shape it was claimed to have been, so that repairs were not feasible, how is it able to still be used? As for mold you may want to take a tour through GCHS and observe the amount of mold on the cafeteria walls and ceiling, in the hallways and in some classrooms. I would suggest you stay away from the restrooms they exceed filthy and you may catch something.
I’m glad to see that we seem to agree about the new Central Office annex. I was not opposed to the building but in its position on the priority list and the way it was so deviously being presented. It’s the same problem with the roofs and a number of other needed items. I can not count the number of times money has been given to repair roofs but they never seem to get repaired. Most of the problems being experienced by the school system, in my opinion, are the total lack of credibility. In simple terms the leadership can not be trusted.
I am in full agreement with you that there are many very hard working folks in the Central Office and the Annex but there are many very hard working people throughout the system in the classroom, cafeteria, hallways, bus garage, maintenance department and school offices. My problem is in many situations the ones doing most of the work are the ones getting the least recognition while the “favored” puppies are rewarded with very large salaries. Mrs. White who seems to have the most flexible work schedule in Giles County makes over $44,000.00 and has much of her work done or re-done by others making much less.
I wonder, do you find it a bit unusual that the school director here makes more than the Director in Murfreesboro who had more than twice the number of students? Do you find it odd that there are now seventeen supervisor/directors working in the Central Office and they have nineteen helpers without any significant increase in student population? Can you help me understand now school spending has exceeded 25% during the past few years while inflation has increased only about nine percent during the same time period?
I agree with you that “Not everyone is on the level with Jackson” but the way I see things when a person tolerates or enables wrong behavior they become apart of that wrong.
I must disagree with your statement, “please let me re-phasize, this money was locked into an irrevocable "line item" for lack of a better term, there was no other option but to use it for building a co”. There is no such thing as an “irrevocable line item” and there are always options there just has to be an interest in finding them.
As for your information I for one appreciate it and the opportunity to respond. I understand your need to remain anonymous and respect your efforts to inform and I hope also to be informed. It’s important that we share as much information as possible if we are to grow and increase in knowledge. I wouldn’t be concerned about what the response to your post is I think most serious post get a serious response. Thanks, Allen Barrett
Mr. Barrett, I am the one to whom you addressed your post and isn't this refreshing? This is the way the blog is supposed to work. We are discussing issues, maybe disagreeing, no name calling, respecting each other's point of view, etc, etc, etc. Anybody out there paying attention? I am in total agreement with your statements regarding the mold in other school facilities. I've seen it first hand. Also I am aware of the situation with the "flexible", (tongue in cheek, of course) work schedule of some at the co, their salaries and the salaries of the ones who clean up the mess of the higher paid employees. No, with the growth in Rutherford County, I cannot fathom why Mr. Jackson's salary is higher than their director, for the overseeing of eight schools. But I don't understand many things regarding Giles County politics and I am a college educated professional. (please note everybody that is ready to pounce, I said educated, not smart! not necessarily synonyms) I have examined the budgets extensively and have questioned the switching of funds from this area to that one and so forth. I do not know how they are getting away with it, and I mean the ones that have the power to make decisions, not the ones that are instructed to do what they are told by their supervisors. I will, however be the first to admit that I do not understand all of the state and federal guidelines of the budget, but as far as teachers salaries go, I do know this as a fact. State law, not local says that raises must come from recurring funds only, not surplus, which is the justification for teachers not getting a raise this past year. (They could have received a bonus, however, and been in compliance with state law), and I am fairly certain that it was totaly and completely Kathy Norman's and Tee Jackson's mission to prevent that from happening. But back to the building fund, as I said, I am no expert, and I also said "for lack of a better term", it is still my understanding that since that money was earmarked for a purpose, unless it was used for the designated building, or whatever, it had to remain "unspent". (I know this is not great English, but I think most folks who want to discuss the issues will get the idea and those that just want to gripe will do so anyway). I do not know if that particular fund is monitored by the state, feds, or locals, that is what I meant by "irrevocable." I guess my point would be in all this is, I truly believe a new building was needed and it would have been a better investment in the long run, to remove the old and start fresh with one building. Even if some consider the co building a luxury, and I do understand why some think that, I have no problem agreeing to disagree, the board was going to build anyway and I stand by my statement that it would have been smarter to build a new building rather than an annex. As for the poster who suggested getting bleach to correct the mold problem, I can only assume as a mature adult who seriously wants to better our community, that you were joking with us. We all need a good laugh now in then. Everyone who has heard a news report and has any reading comprehension skills at all, knows how serious mold can be in any building in even small quantities and as Mr. Barrett stated correctly, it is everywhere. But my common sense tells me that as dangerous as the spores from mold are, I am pretty sure that the fumes from chlorine bleach are at least equally dangerous and the massive cleanup from a mold infestation should only be umdertaken by professionals. One last note, thank you for placing teaching pay high on your list of priorities, Mr. Barrett, as I happen to be one, and if you hadn't realized it, we have conversed amicably, (not always agreeing, but never rude in my memory) over this blog in the past.
sincerely
anon56
Thanks anon56.Allen Barrett
1119 Wasn't kidding about bleach - it is used routinely in laundry, as a disinfectant, and many other uses, - it is an essential purification ingredient in drinking water, pools, etc. A very little bleach in water KILLS MOULD! Soap???
Mould & mildew is everywhere in this geographical location - some people can't live here because of alergies to mould. I doubt there is a dwelling in Tennessee that is "mould free".
Bleach, like many other chemicals can be dangerous, even deadly if mixed with other reactive ingredients - some reactions can generate chlorine gas, etc.
Then I must apologize for assuming to much. I got the impression that the mold problems in our schools could, according to you, could simply be cleaned up with a little bleach and elbow grease. Surely you don't believe the citizens who are not trained in this highly specialized hazardous material use should attempt to clean this up? If clean up was even possible, it would take professionals to do it, hundreds of man hours and thousands of dollars. Sir, or ma'am, as I understand the gravity of the situation, it is slightly more complicated than cleaning soap scum out of a bathtub. I mean no disrespect. This is a fairly new area of study and many people do not realize that to simply go scrub the mold will
in fact increase rather than decrease the areas affected. Mold spores grow at a rapid pace and when disturbed, as with a stiff scrubbing, spores would undoubtably land in other sections of the infected building and multipy at an alarming rate. It is not a job that a trip to Save A Lot can fix.
anon56
Anon56 said:
It is not a job that a trip to Save A Lot can fix.
Well, you've got me sold! The cost of eliminating mold will likely exceed the value of the school buildings. So let's just tear them all down, and start over....
Here is something I proposed last year, about a week before my mother died... see what you think about this idea:
Classroom teachers have probably the highest paying jobs in this impoverished county -- normalized over 12 months, they make $51,149 per annum -- and benefit from the ironclad job security that only a unionized govermment worker can ever expect to see. Plus, they are absolutely never held accountable for the work they do, either at an individual level (ie, you and I both know incompetent teachers that will never be fired) or at the institutional level (ie, the school system keeps getting increasing amounts of money shovelled into it, no matter how poor a job it does educating kids).
I know that a lot of people will read this, and want to accuse me of "teacher bashing." But the truth is, I think teaching is one of the most important professions around, and, if I was named dictator, one of the first changes I would make, would be to raise teacher pay to where it was comparable to lawyer pay. (Make me dictator, and I'll also, in a heart beat, cut pay for shysters, but that's another story!)
Even though I'd like to see teachers paid more, and feel it is a shame that some of the really good teachers I remember from my school days, were never paid enough for the work they did... the fact is that teacher pay will never go up, as long as they remain mired in a government run monopoly, paid equally no matter what their performance.
Only if the schools are privatized, will teachers (the good ones, anyway) ever see a major pay increase. Right now, Giles County teachers only get 36.4% of the $7,465 spent per year on each student...
If the schools were privatized, they could operate without worrying about frivolous "civil rights" lawsuits preventing them from enforcing real discipline. Effective discipline would mean that classroom sizes could go back to 32/class, as they were back in the 1950's.
Given that there are 4,269 students to educate in Giles County, that means that we only need to employ 134 teachers. In turn, this means that we could give all the current crop of teachers a rigorous competency test, keeping 134 (the top 44% of those now employed), while laying off the remaining, less competent, 168.
Now for the fun part! We multiply the "Expenditure per Average Daily Attendence" ($7,465) by the "Average Daily Attendence" (4,269) to get a total school expenditure of $31,868,085. Now, we divide that gargantuan figure by the number of teachers (134) and come up with exactly $237,821.53 per teacher. (Which would be equivalent to working a $317,095.37 year round job... which is much better than most lawyers haul in!)
So, I have one simple question for all of you school teachers out there: If I paid you $237,821.53 for you to teach 32 kids, whom you could discipline in whatever manner you saw fit... would this be worth it to you? Obviously, you'd have to pay a mortgage and utilities on your one room school house. And, you might be out of pocket something if you chose to furnish hot meals.
Suppose the county floated a twenty year bond to pay for the construction of 134 one room schbols, distributed all across the county, so that no bussing would be required. Suppose further, that the county divided their bond payments into 134 equal amounts, and charged them to the teachers, who would own their schools outright after twenty years. It's likely, in that case, that the mortgage would run only $1,500 per month, with utilities running another $1,000. That's only $30,000 per year, which would leave each teacher almost $208,000 per year as take home pay. (Okay, maybe hot lunches would be catered for 32 kids for $100 per day... given a 180 long school year, that would subtract another $18,000; leaving $190,000 in net pay.
Please note that, under my proposal, the kids would be taught with only the "cream" of the current teaching staff, and would (assuming a $190,000 net) be paid over 495% of current "classroom teacher" salaries. That sounds like a pretty sweet deal to me, although it would mean that every teacher would be divested of union coddling, and would have to "root hog or die" on the free market.
But, really, that's the best part! Because, if parents are given an "education stamp" voucher, and the teachers are all independant entrepreneurs competing with each other to get those vouchers, then the "hidden hand" of capitalism will inevitably lead to ever higher performance, both by the teachers, and the students. Indeed, under a system such as I've proposed, I expect that Giles County children would be the best educated in the United States, if not the whole world!
We have only our children's chains to lose, and a whole world of excellence in education, to attain. Why not do it... now, before any more kids have their intellects sacrificed on the altar of bureaucratic socialism?
All you "pro-government" and "non-whiner" types out there, I dare you to challenge my figures, or to come up with a better way to spend $7,465 per kid per annum on K-12 education. Go ahead... take your best shot, and let the chips fall where they may!
Anon56, what do you think? Could you "cut the mustard" in a capitalist school system? Would a $200,000 per year salary be sufficient motivation to get you to do your best? And, being free of three levels of bureaucracy (plus three levels of judges), would you be able to maintain effective discipline, under rules of your own making?
I'm not kidding here... I'd really like to see your answers to these questions. Many thanks in advance!
Please tell me how building a new building will solve the mold problem in Giles county. Want the mold come back in the new building, just tear that one down and build again.
I'm really wanting to know how to solve the mold problem, I have it in my house. Have been trying to wash with colorox. It's gone, but it hasn't been long enough to know if it will come back, guess I can wash again.
There seems to be lots of questions about mold and how to get rid of it.
The absolute most important ting about controlling mold is to control moisture. Control the moisture and you control the mold.
A mixture of water and bleach will kill the mold but if the moisture isn’t controlled the mold will come back. If the mold is thoroughly wetted before you begin to scrub, the mold spores will be too heavy to fly through the air.
For those fearful of using bleach, most any detergent and water will clean it. After the area is thoroughly dried you can paint or use a sealer to help the situation but again it’s the moisture that allows the mold to grow. A good vent fan in the bathroom will help, a dehumidifier will help greatly. Getting dry air circulating in the area is the only sure way to control mold.
Two major problems in our schools is the porous ceiling tiles and carpet both need to be gotten rid of. The tiles can not be cleaned and the carpet is a breeding ground for many dangerous and even deadly organisms. Hope this helps. Allen Barrett
Anon 56 - The first premise is as Kendrick stated - the mould comes back because this is TN, not Las Vegas. The second part of that statement is the geographical location of TN - not the desert, but relatively high humidity, etc. which brings us back to Mr. Barret - things that retain moisture & are difficult to clean - carpets & porus objects (certain tiles, non enamel paint, walls that are not sealed with caulk, etc. - all kinds of stuff that is more than likely far more serious in 99% of the homes we sleep in.
Political corruptness tells us to bury this crap below ground level in hemetrically sealed SS containers as if it were nuklar (Carterisee) waste. A stroke of a cigarett lighter does the same thing - poof & gone with the smoke - back through the greenery & into the oxygen you breathe.
THE KEY - a little bleach & soap (yellow clouders can turn & run) a little elbow work &, as you said, it's gone, BUT IF YOU WANT TO LIVE HERE, you got to do it frequently - it's called house cleaning!!!!!!!!
SCHOOLS - a sealed environment!!! Only an idiot would not have controlled humidity! Granted, it's the schools, only an idiot would not make sure the electrical outlets, plumbing outlets through walls, etc are SEALED! THEM?? Then apply a simple paint to the walls (already done it?) & whatever is in the wall is sealed!!!
EVER WONDERED HOW our forefathers made it through life??? Foremother washed things!!
EVER EAT A MUSHROOM???
note - not mad at you & not trying to ridicule, but mould is relatively simple & inexpensive to deal with, IF we keep the shysters global warmists, Chicken Little, & liberals out of the equations. don't really care how you vote, either. Keep the dialogue going & hang in there. You might make someone mad enough to get down on all fours & do some cleaning!
From anon56, Agreed, a LITTLE mold is relatively easy to get rid of by cleaning, but as WAB pointed out, useless unless the moisture problem is removed. I will be the first to admit, I don't have the answer and am not applying for the job of cleaning it up.
Mr. McPeters, how do you propose to measure teacher competance? By children's test scores? One test for an entire year? Testing teachers? How many tests? Answers on a piece of paper equal competance in the classroom? Do you value theory over experience? Both have their place? Who determines "cream of the crop"? And I challenge your figures of the median salary in Giles Co being 51 k unless you are including supervisors and Jackson's salary. And yes, I would do the job for 200 k. I do it now for far less.
anon56
Anon56 said:
Mr. McPeters, how do you propose to measure teacher competance?
Actually, my preference would be to have a totally free market in education, which would mean that the parents would be the ones "measuring" teacher competence, by whatever metric they happened to favor.
However, I was talking about the county testing teachers in order to distinguish the wheat from the chaff, so I will offer a suggestion on how to do that.
First of all, I agree that a test score, alone, is no reliable indicator of teacher ability. Just as a doctor might have scored tremendously on his exams, and yet completely lack "bed side manner," so too might a high IQ teacher know the material backwards and forwards, and yet be unable to stir any interest from the kids.
On the other hand, a standardized test score isn't exactly nothing. We could weed out the grossly incompetent, simply by firing those who haven't mastered the material they are supposed to teach. And with the grossly incompetent out of the way, we could then try determing which teachers are not merely competent, but exceptional.
I suggest that (without any teacher's knowledge) pinhole TV cameras be placed in every school room. Then, an evaluation team -- made up of "out of town" parents who have raised at least two children who attained four year college degrees -- would watch the teachers go about their daily business. Ultimately, they would vote -- like judges at a figure skating contest -- and the teachers with the highest average scores, would be the ones retained by the county, and assigned to one of the "one room" schoolhouses.
I challenge your figures of the median salary in Giles Co being 51 k unless you are including supervisors and Jackson's salary.
I'm afraid you missed an important qualifier -- "normalized over 12 months." Take what you are paid for nine months work, multiply by 1.33, and you wind up with $51,000 per year. Teacher's salaries must be "normalized" when comparing them with those of people who are paid to work year round-- otherwise you're comparing apples and oranges, I'm afraid.
I would do the job for 200 k. I do it now for far less.
I'm sure you do... but right now you have a bit of a "safety net." Teacher tenure, and union protections make it all but impossible to fire you. Plus, whether your performance satisfies parents, or not, is fairly unimportant, given the current system.
What I am proposing is a FREE MARKET (subsidized by local government) in education. You could, in theory, make five times your current rate of pay... but you could also fail to attract any paying customers, and thus make nothing.
You'd be totally on your own... like a homeschooling mom, you would pick the curriculum, and set the rules. If a child broke the rules, you could expel him... and, with a "no refunds" policy, you'd even be able to keep the tuition money that had been pre-paid. Do you think that would serve as an incentive for parents to get involved? I do!
Anon56, please consider all the plusses and minuses of letting go of bureaucracy, and becoming a "free enterprise" teacher. Are you confident enough in your ability and experience that you'd give up the "safety net" in exchange for the chance to make $200,000 per year? Think about it, and let me know. Thanks!
From anon56: I must first apologize. I have been highly critical of people who will not post on topic. That being said, as I eat crow for dinner, being a stubborn southerner, I cannot resist replying to Mr. McPeters. First of all, I did not design the educational system, so I have no authority to change it. I believe true change for people, organizations, governments, etc must start internally for it to be lasting and productive. So, no sir, I will not abandon the system for anarchy. Change is needed, massive change over a brief period of time breeds resentment, error, and waste. Cameras in every classroom, I have no problem with: bank tellers, cashiers, and many occupations work under that type of scrutiny, and the fact that "big brother" is indeed watching would, in my opinion outweigh the upside that parents would see that "little Johnny" is not always the perfect angel who is a being picked on by the teacher who is encouraging others to bully him. As for teachers being "fire proof", the only place that that is true is in the minds of the people who do not understand the tenure law. It's about due process and in my opinion any ethical employer should offer such a benefit. And on a final note, the salary of teachers...we are not paid for 12 months, nor for the hours we work after school, nor reimbursed for the money we spend out of our pocket, or the parent conferences we must have in the grocery store because mom is upset about something, nor the phone calls we must take while our families eat dinner, and I've been a teacher a long time and have yet to have "summers off." Mr.McPeters, I issue another challenge: please list as many other professional occupations as you can that require a minimum bachelor's degree, the passing of a standardized test, fingerprinting, and a starting salary of maybe
30k/year.
I am very much enjoying this debate, sir and I truly mean no disrespect but I do not feel that this is the topic of this particular thread. Start a new one and I will be glad to continue this "verbal volleyball."
anon56
Mr. McPeters, I am not a teacher but I know that if the students start school the 1st of August and get out the last week in May that only leaves two months, June and July. There are 12 months in a year, minus the two(2)months school is not in session, that leaves ten (10) months that the teachers work plus any kind of extra work in prepreration that they must do and I am sure they go in before schools starts in August and after it end in May. Gee, I am not a college educated person and I can get ten months of work not nine. I guess you need to come up with your salary figure again, huh!!
Teachers are scheduled to work 200 days a year. Students are scheduled for 180 days. When you consider sick days and personal days off how many actually work 200 days or how many students actually attend 180 days of classes?
teach:
200/365=55% 180/365=49%
m0m & pop:
5/7=71% 2/52=3.8% & 1/52 = 1.9%
BIG difference between the average employee & the teacher ojt
8 till 2 = 6 hr vs 8 hr = 75% ojt
if they make up the other 2 before / after class hrs. it's = ???
Teachers are required to be at school long before 8. Also I don't know of a school anywhere that gets out at 2. Even so teachers don't leave school when the kids do. If you are going to figure something at least make it accurate. My child is off the bus at or before 7:30 in the morning and does not leave until after 2:30. There are teachers and assistants helping them to and from buses morning and afternoon. When do you think these teachers do grading. They can't teach and grade at the same time. They also have to prepare homework, test and teaching prep. I don't work for the school but I am no idiot to think that they don't have other work that goes on after hours. I also know that some spend their summers refreshing their education. I don't know many people who are average employees who have to take work home with them (unless they are getting paid for it) and who have to talk to clients during supper or at night. You go educators, assistants, cafeteria workers, secretaries and custodians. We appreciate you even if others don't.
These people have NO earthly idea how tough it is to be a teacher in today's society. In addition to grading papers, preparing lessons, sponsoring clubs, and on and on, they have to put up with rude and disrespectful kids who don't want to be in school to begin with. It's those troublemakers (and sometimes their parents) who make it easy for teachers to say that they earn EVERY DIME they are paid. In the real world, disruptive and troublesome individuals are FIRED for irresponsible behaviors, but that's not the case with the public school system. Having said that, I believe the troublemaking and disruptive students should be placed in some type of alternative learning situation. I'm fairly certain that most teachers would agree with that. But for now, they are forced to teach in spite of the bad ones. Isn't it a pity?
Monday, March 17, 2008 10:05:00 AM
Your post would of been good on the home school site. It's also why parents would want to home school.
I feel very sorry for the teachers for what they have to go through.
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